Legislature(1997 - 1998)

03/12/1997 03:22 PM House L&C

Audio Topic
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
txt
          HOUSE LABOR AND COMMERCE STANDING COMMITTEE                          
                         March 12, 1997                                        
                           3:22 p.m.                                           
                                                                               
                                                                               
 MEMBERS PRESENT                                                               
                                                                               
 Representative Norman Rokeberg, Chairman                                      
 Representative John Cowdery, Vice Chairman                                    
 Representative Bill Hudson                                                    
 Representative Jerry Sanders                                                  
 Representative Joe Ryan                                                       
 Representative Tom Brice                                                      
 Representative Gene Kubina                                                    
                                                                               
 MEMBERS ABSENT                                                                
                                                                               
 All members present                                                           
                                                                               
 COMMITTEE CALENDAR                                                            
                                                                               
 *HOUSE BILL NO. 179                                                           
 "An Act relating to fraternal benefit societies; and providing for            
 an effective date."                                                           
                                                                               
      - MOVED CSHB 179(L&C) OUT OF COMMITTEE                                   
                                                                               
 *HOUSE BILL NO. 10                                                            
 "An Act requiring mediation in a civil action against an architect,           
 engineer, or land surveyor; amending Rule 100, Alaska Rules of                
 Civil Procedure; and providing for an effective date."                        
                                                                               
      - MOVED CSHB 10(L&C) OUT OF COMMITTEE                                    
                                                                               
 (* First public hearing)                                                      
                                                                               
 PREVIOUS ACTION                                                               
                                                                             
 BILL:  HB 179                                                               
 SHORT TITLE: FRATERNAL BENEFIT SOCIETIES                                      
 SPONSOR(S): LABOR & COMMERCE BY REQUEST                                       
                                                                               
 JRN-DATE      JRN-PG         ACTION                                           
 03/06/97       561    (H)   READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRAL(S)                 
 03/06/97       561    (H)   LABOR & COMMERCE, JUDICIARY                       
 03/12/97              (H)   L&C AT  3:15 PM CAPITOL 17                        
                                                                               
 BILL:  HB 10                                                                
 SHORT TITLE: MANDATORY MEDIATION/DESIGN PROF LAWSUITS                         
 SPONSOR(S): REPRESENTATIVE(S) GREEN                                           
                                                                               
 JRN-DATE      JRN-PG         ACTION                                           
 01/13/97        29    (H)   PREFILE RELEASED 1/3/97                           
 01/13/97        29    (H)   READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRAL(S)                 
 01/13/97        29    (H)   LABOR & COMMERCE, JUD, FINANCE                    
 03/12/97              (H)   L&C AT  3:15 PM CAPITOL 17                        
                                                                               
 ACTION NARRATIVE                                                              
                                                                               
 WITNESS REGISTER                                                              
                                                                               
 Richard Kleven                                                                
 Assistant Vice President                                                      
 Lutheran Brotherhood of the                                                   
   Fraternal Brotherhood Society                                               
 National Fraternal Congress                                                   
 625 Fourth Avenue South                                                       
 Minneapolis, Minnesota  55415                                                 
 Telephone:  (612) 340-7216                                                    
 POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified on HB 179                                      
                                                                               
 DON KOCH, Chief                                                               
 Market Surveillance                                                           
 Division of Insurance                                                         
 P.O. Box 110805                                                               
 Juneau, Alaska  99811-0805                                                    
 Telephone:  (907) 465-2577                                                    
 POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified in support of HB 179                           
                                                                               
 JEFF LOGAN, Legislative Assistant                                             
 Representative Joseph Green                                                   
 Alaska State Legislature                                                      
 State Capitol, Room 118                                                       
 Juneau, Alaska  99801                                                         
 Telephone:  (907) 465- 4931                                                   
 POSITION STATEMENT:  Provided information on HB 10                            
                                                                               
 DOUG WOOLIVER, Administrative Attorney                                        
 Office of the Administrative Director                                         
 Alaska Court System                                                           
 820 W 4th Avenue                                                              
 Anchorage, Alaska  99501-2005                                                 
 Telephone:  (907) 264-8265                                                    
 POSITION STATEMENT:  Provided information on HB 10                            
                                                                               
 TAPE 97-20, SIDE A                                                            
 Number 001                                                                    
                                                                               
 CHAIRMAN NORMAN ROKEBERG called the House Labor and Commerce                  
 Standing Committee to order at 3:22 p.m.  Members present at the              
 call to order were Cowdery, Hudson, Sanders and Brice.                        
 Representatives Ryan and Kubina arrived at the respective times:              
 3:25 p.m. and 3:30 p.m.                                                       
                                                                               
 HB 179 - FRATERNAL BENEFIT SOCIETIES                                        
                                                                               
 CHAIRMAN ROKEBERG indicated that the committee would consider House           
 Bill 179, "An Act relating to fraternal benefit societies; and                
 providing for an effective date."                                             
                                                                               
 Number 092                                                                    
                                                                               
 RICHARD KLEVEN, Assistant Vice President, Lutheran Brotherhood of             
 the Fraternal Brotherhood Society, National Fraternal Congress,               
 came forward to testify on HB 179.  He stated that this bill was              
 very similar to one that has been passed in approximately 35 other            
 states.  Fraternal benefit societies are self-help membership                 
 organizations.  They are created by people usually of a common                
 religion, ethnic, or national origin.  He mentioned the ones                  
 operating in the state of Alaska: Knights of Columbus, Independent            
 Order of Foresters, Sons of Norway, Aid Association for Lutherans             
 and Woodman of the World.  These are organizations that exist to              
 benefit their members and communities.  They are very tightly                 
 controlled by the members through a representative form of                    
 government.  Lodges are required to exist by law.  There are 45 of            
 them in the state of Alaska that gather for fellowship, but they              
 also to do volunteer work.                                                    
                                                                               
 Number 218                                                                    
                                                                               
 MR. KLEVEN stated that these organizations offer their members                
 insurance products on a limited basis, usually life and annuity               
 benefits.  In Alaska there are about 7,000 fraternals.  In 1995 the           
 fraternals provided about a 1/4 of a million dollars in aid to                
 various charitable projects in the state and their members                    
 contributed about 58,000 hours of volunteer service.  There                   
 currently exists a chapter in Alaska law which regulates these                
 organizations, but noted that it's been 30 years since this                   
 original law was passed in 1966.  There has been a lot of                     
 regulatory and legal changes on the federal level since then.  Some           
 of what these organizations would like to do under existing law run           
 afoul with some of the IRS regulations, Securities and Exchange               
 Commission Laws, and laws affecting tax and financial planning.               
 They need a code which keeps better pace with what's going on.                
                                                                               
 Number 305                                                                    
                                                                               
 MR. KLEVEN stated that the bill was 28 pages long.  Generally,                
 there is nothing in the bill that radically changes anything.  It             
 allows fraternals to write variable life and annuity products.                
 These are products written by most life insurers and are primarily            
 regulated by the federal government as well as by the state's                 
 Division of Insurance.  Variable contracts are regulated by the               
 Securities and Exchange Commission and the way the fraternal laws             
 are written now it is impossible for them to write the types of               
 insurance their members want.  This change in law will also allow             
 some flexibility in the law so that when new kinds of insurance               
 products are created, the Director of Insurance will have the                 
 authority to approve those if they are appropriate for fraternals             
 to write.  It also makes it clear that fraternals can have                    
 subsidiaries do things that are in furtherance of their purposes              
 which are required by law to be charitable, fraternal, educational,           
 religious, patriotic or moral.                                                
                                                                               
 MR. KLEVEN continued that this legislation would also help improve            
 some of the regulatory language in the Alaska code so it's clear              
 that unfair trade practice issues or market conduct apply to the              
 fraternals as they do to the commercials.  This is only fair.  The            
 fraternals should be bound by these, whether licensing requirements           
 or other.  This bill will make it clear that their members are                
 allowed assignments to their policies, issue contracts on a third             
 party basis, or irrevocable beneficiaries, etc.  These are all                
 important tools in tax, financial and estate planning.  This bill             
 also does a lot of things in updating language.  It makes it                  
 clearer what the Director of Insurance can do, what the directors'            
 regulatory authority is over the fraternals, reorganizes sections             
 of the code, makes them gender neutral, provides more up-to-date              
 language, but it still maintains their essential character.  They             
 are required to be a charitable organization.  All the same                   
 elements are there and won't change what small place the fraternals           
 have in this market place.  This legislation won't affect any of              
 the existing members in the state either, but it should provide               
 them better protection and more flexibility.                                  
                                                                               
 Number 549                                                                    
                                                                               
 MR. KLEVEN noted two amendments would be considered and his                   
 organization supports both of these.  One of these amendments is              
 technical in nature to make sure that the changes made in the law             
 today will conform with the Kassenbalm/Kennedy law regarding health           
 insurance which passed at the federal level last year.  The other             
 amendment is also technical and makes it clear how fraternals are             
 governed.  In most cases, their supreme governing body is not their           
 Board of Directors, but instead, is something called the General              
 Assembly.  This amendment makes it clear that anybody at any level            
 running for this General Assembly has to be a member of the                   
 society.                                                                      
                                                                               
 Number 618                                                                    
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE JOHN COWDERY asked how the Alaska legislation was              
 different from that passed in the other 30 or so states.                      
                                                                               
 MR. KLEVEN responded that these differences were very subtle.  The            
 basic thrust of this Alaska legislation is very close to the model            
 passed in every other state.  There is no substantial difference to           
 speak of at all.   Every state has its way to write code and there            
 might be a nuance, for instance, related to agent licensing.  A few           
 states have not wanted to take the approach of re-writing the                 
 entire code.  They've done so piecemeal.  Thirty-three of the 37              
 have taken the broader approach, which in Alaska the Division of              
 Insurance supports.                                                           
                                                                               
 Number 688                                                                    
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE JOE RYAN said that he was interested in what and how           
 they do estate planning.  He asked what the extent of this was.               
                                                                               
 MR. KLEVEN responded that their members buy insurance from them.              
 They often buy this product in the context of estate planning.  The           
 fraternal organization doesn't do the estate planning, but the                
 client works with a local attorney to do so.  They do have experts            
 in their home office who will educate the field employees about               
 such things, but they insist that people use their own attorneys or           
 local tax advisors in the overall estate planning.                            
                                                                               
 Number 743                                                                    
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE BILL HUDSON asked, in the absence of this                      
 legislation, who would provide these services.                                
                                                                               
 MR. KLEVEN stated that Alaska has a code on the books now.  They              
 could continue to operate under this code, but feel they could do             
 a better job with a new one.                                                  
                                                                               
 Number 764                                                                    
                                                                               
 CHAIRMAN ROKEBERG said it was interesting to note that the term               
 "domestic" in the statute relates to an organization organized in             
 the state of Alaska, that "domestic" equals Alaskan and therefore,            
 "foreign" means an organization from the outside.  The fraternal              
 organizations operating in the state of Alaska are of foreign                 
 status under this legislation.  This bill is set up in large part             
 to deal with any organization that wishes to establish itself in              
 Alaska.                                                                       
                                                                               
 MR. KLEVEN responded that this was correct.                                   
                                                                               
 Number 820                                                                    
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE JERRY SANDERS asked if the fraternals broker                   
 insurance for insurance company or do they operate as an insurance            
 company.                                                                      
                                                                               
 MR. KLEVEN responded that they have their own insurance operation.            
 Lutheran Brotherhood, for example, issues life and annuity policies           
 and long term care for members on their paper.  These fraternal               
 organizations write their own insurance.  The Alaska Division of              
 Insurance regulates them.  Almost all of the laws governing life              
 and annuity insurance would also apply to the fraternals.  They are           
 required to meet financial tests, generate reports, follow                    
 restrictions on how they invest, etc.  He stated that this code               
 helps to clarify some of these things.                                        
                                                                               
 Number 880                                                                    
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE TOM BRICE asked if a domestic organization under               
 these new laws discriminates based on age, sex, nationality, etc.             
                                                                               
 MR. KLEVEN responded that a domestic society can be created in                
 Alaska with membership requirements.  Usually these are religion              
 based with certain purposes outlined.  The Lutheran Brotherhood is            
 religious and all its members are Lutheran.  To that extent only              
 those people and their families are eligible.  He didn't think                
 whether one could be created based on age or anything like that, he           
 didn't think that has ever been done.  He did give a breakdown of             
 age requirements for the Lutheran Brotherhood.                                
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE BRICE inquired whether the Lutheran Brotherhood                
 excluded women.                                                               
                                                                               
 MR. KLEVEN responded that no, they did not.                                   
                                                                               
 Number 974                                                                    
                                                                               
 CHAIRMAN ROKEBERG asked if there was anything in this legislation             
 to restrict the marketing of their product, such as requiring that            
 someone be part of a member's immediate family and asked, if so,              
 was there anything in place where they could step beyond this.                
                                                                               
 MR. KLEVEN noted that societies have their own rules regarding                
 membership which generally regard immediate family members.                   
                                                                               
 Number 988                                                                    
                                                                               
 CHAIRMAN ROKEBERG asked what the origin of this insurance service             
 was.                                                                          
                                                                               
 MR. KLEVEN responded that these services were organized by                    
 immigrants at the turn of the century.  These were people who                 
 couldn't get insurance or needed to bond together for other                   
 reasons, not just for insurance then or now.  These organizations             
 are self-help groups who help each other and the cause that they              
 are formed around whether this be a religion or communities in                
 general.  The same charitable purposes exist today.                           
                                                                               
 Number 1085                                                                   
                                                                               
 DON KOCH, Chief, Market Surveillance, Division of Insurance, came             
 forward to testify in support of HB 179.  The Division has been               
 involved from the standpoint of looking at the changes that the               
 fraternals wished to make.  They've had a fair amount of input as             
 it has progressed and there are not a lot of areas where they have            
 concern.  Mr. Koch reviewed the bill, as well as the Division's               
 financial staff and they've had about four other different areas of           
 the Division that have looked at this legislation in one form or              
 another.                                                                      
                                                                               
 MR. KOCH stated that many of the changes can be characterized as              
 reorganization of the code itself into areas of interest; for                 
 example, the things which relate to the financial regulation have             
 been put into one area of this chapter, where before some of these            
 were scattered around.  A number of those changes have very little            
 difference in the existing text as versus the new text.  One of the           
 bigger changes is the ability for fraternals to establish separate            
 accounts for the purpose of supporting variable products, such as             
 life and annuities.  The other life insurers have had this                    
 opportunity available to them since the late 60's.                            
                                                                               
 Number 1218                                                                   
                                                                               
 MR. KOCH responded to the "foreign" versus "domestic" conversation            
 earlier and noted that this was an already existing distinction               
 that's been in the code for a long time.  He continued that a                 
 domestic insurer has been referred to as "domiciled" in the state             
 and foreign insurers are everyone else.  A further distinction is             
 made that an insurer from another country is called an "alien"                
 insurer.                                                                      
                                                                               
 MR. KOCH added that the Division proposes an amendment to this                
 legislation.  He provided a copy of it to the committee.  The                 
 fraternal code has a provision in it that lists all of the statutes           
 outside of that particular chapter which applies to a fraternal.              
 This is an area where such things are considered such as the Unfair           
 Trade Practices Act and the licensing statutes, etc.  These are all           
 things external to that chapter of law referenced in this                     
 particular area.  The Department of Law noted that they had                   
 neglected to list two chapters of the insurance code that contained           
 provisions affecting group health insurance in this legislation               
 which are also being addressed in the Kassenbalm/Kennedy bill.                
 This new federal law will impose certain things on anyone writing             
 health insurance.  That reference was left out of this fraternal              
 bill, but this change is enumerated in this amendment to read as              
 follows:                                                                      
                                                                               
 Following Line 7 on Page 18, insert the following:                            
                                                                               
 "(15) AS 21.54;                                                               
  (16) AS 21.56;"                                                              
                                                                               
 Renumber existing (15) through (18) accordingly.                              
                                                                               
 MR. KOCH continued that the references to these two chapters are              
 references to group health insurance statutes in the code to make             
 sure that those also apply to fraternals should they write this               
 type of insurance.  For the most part, fraternals do not write                
 group products, but individual ones.  Typically these fraternals              
 write only for their members and their direct family.  He noted               
 that he was also a member of a fraternal, the Knights of Columbus,            
 and noted all the charitable activities they are involved in.  He             
 noted that insurance was incidental to their activities.                      
                                                                               
 Number 1443                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE GENE KUBINA noted that this legislation seemed to              
 strengthen some of the provisions in the existing law, for example,           
 increasing the bonding required rather than lowering it.  He asked            
 if this was accurate.                                                         
                                                                               
 MR. KOCH responded that this was accurate.  The legislation is                
 really an attempt to update the current law which was originally              
 adopted in 1966 when Alaska first accepted the insurance code.                
 There have been a lot of changes since this time, the least of                
 which that some amounts appropriated as standards back then are no            
 longer appropriate now.  These have been upgraded.  He thought                
 there was a lot to this bill which made language more clear.  It's            
 a long piece of legislation, but he stated that it does tend to               
 strengthen the existing law.  As a regulator he supports this                 
 concept.                                                                      
                                                                               
 Number 1516                                                                   
                                                                               
 MR. KOCH shared an additional observation.  A few years ago he and            
 Division personnel were concerned about what constituted a                    
 fraternal organization and how they operated.  With that they                 
 looked at the fraternals with insurance ratings in the state.  At             
 that time there were five existing that had some level of premium             
 volume written in the state of Alaska.  They examined four of these           
 five, one was so small, it wasn't worth bothering with.  They sent            
 examiners in to get a good idea of how they operated.  These were             
 market conduct exams as opposed to financial exams.  They were                
 fairly impressed because the things they might compare with when              
 looking at a life insurer they noted how some big differences                 
 existed.  Generally, these differences were favorable, things which           
 were done right as compared to how other types of entities                    
 conducted business, things they didn't have the same comfort level            
 were working as they should.                                                  
                                                                               
 Number 1580                                                                   
                                                                               
 CHAIRMAN ROKEBERG asked if the fraternals were more conservative in           
 their financial decision making.                                              
                                                                               
 MR. KOCH said he couldn't speak to the financial aspects of these             
 organizations since he wasn't involved with this aspect of the                
 review.  These were market conduct exams which take a look at how             
 they settle claims, how they deal with customers and how they                 
 generally conduct themselves.  They were fairly impressed.  The               
 level of cooperation was greater.                                             
                                                                               
 Number 1629                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE HUDSON asked what positive or negative impact this             
 legislation will have on military fraternal organizations.                    
                                                                               
 MR. KOCH stated that these organizations are not fraternals in the            
 sense intended by this chapter of law.  These are commercial                  
 insurers.  This would have no affect on them.  These military                 
 organizations have product opportunities the fraternals don't have,           
 but hope to gain.  They see no reason to bar them from this.                  
                                                                               
 Number 1702                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE KUBINA made a motion to move amendment number one as           
 outlined.  Hearing no objection it was so ordered.                            
                                                                               
 Number 1715                                                                   
                                                                               
 CHAIRMAN ROKEBERG introduced amendment number two as follows:                 
                                                                               
 Page 1, Line 13 after "body":                                                 
                                                                               
 Insert:  ",or any intermediate assembly"                                      
                                                                               
 Number 1760                                                                   
                                                                               
 MR. KLEVEN offered to explain the reason for this change.                     
 Fraternal organizations are membership groups.  Their supreme                 
 governing body can be organized in two ways.  A more common way is            
 to have a group formed called the General Assembly which is the               
 supreme governing body.  There is still a Board of Directors, but             
 the General Assembly is elected by the membership and serve as                
 delegates to elect the Board of Directors.  In the case of some               
 fraternal benefit societies, there is an intermediate group before            
 the General Assembly is elected which are called intermediate                 
 assemblies.  These assemblies gather usually in a region to elect             
 delegates.  This amendment clarifies that if there is an                      
 intermediate assembly the only people eligible for this body would            
 be members, just as there is a membership requirement to be elected           
 to the Board of Directors or the General Assembly.                            
                                                                               
 Number 1823                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE SANDERS asked if there were organizations in Alaska            
 that are big enough to have or need this intermediate assemblies.             
                                                                               
 MR. KLEVEN noted that there were no domestics in Alaska; however,             
 if there is representation for any society that operates here,                
 there are going to be members in Alaska that are going to vote.  He           
 stated that it wasn't a function so much dependent on size, but               
 it's the way societies are structured and how they conduct their              
 voting.  There was some further discussion regarding the definition           
 of intermediate assemblies.                                                   
                                                                               
 Number 1897                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE HUDSON made a motion to move amendment number two as           
 outlined.  Hearing no objection it was so moved.                              
                                                                               
 CHAIRMAN ROKEBERG stated that he was reluctant to move this bill              
 out of committee since it was so lengthy.  He wanted to make sure             
 that everyone had read the entire text and noted that he had                  
 planned to assign it to a subcommittee.  The members agreed that              
 they had already read the legislation and felt comfortable moving             
 it from the committee.                                                        
                                                                               
 Number 1936                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE RYAN moved and asked unanimous consent to move HB
 179 out of committee with individual recommendations and the                  
 accompanying fiscal note.  Hearing no objection, CSHB 179(L&C) was            
 moved out of the House Labor and Commerce Committee.                          
                                                                               
 CHAIRMAN ROKEBERG asked Mr. Koch and Mr. Kleven to provide written            
 explanation of the amendments to the committee as attachments to              
 the CS process.                                                               
                                                                               
 HB 10 - MANDATORY MEDIATION/DESIGN PROF LAWSUITS                            
                                                                               
 Number 1990                                                                   
                                                                               
 JEFF LOGAN, Legislative Assistant to Representative Green, came               
 forward to present testimony on HB 10, "An Act requiring mediation            
 in a civil action against an architect, engineer, or land surveyor;           
 amending Rule 100, Alaska Rules of Civil Procedure; and providing             
 for an effective date."  This legislation is an effort to keep                
 people out of court, not by restricting their rights to file an               
 action, but by providing an alternative venue and method to address           
 their complaint.  The goal is to facilitate a mutually agreeable              
 pre-trial settlement.                                                         
                                                                               
 MR. LOGAN continued that if a plaintiff is seeking damages from a             
 design professional the case must go to meditation with a few                 
 limited exceptions.  These are firstly, if all parties to the suit            
 desire to by-pass mediation they go straight to trial.  Secondly,             
 if in those cases where the judge determines that the plaintiff is            
 indigent the judge can require the defendant to pay all the costs             
 of mediation.  In those cases the defendant can refuse this option,           
 by-pass mediation, and go to trial.                                           
                                                                               
 Number 2078                                                                   
                                                                               
 MR. LOGAN walked the committee through the steps allowed for in               
 this legislation.  The process begins by someone filing out a                 
 motion.  The case is assigned to a judge.  On a form the judge will           
 indicate when a case should go through mandatory mediation.  After            
 the defendant is notified there is communication between the judge            
 and the parties.  The court system keeps a list of mediators on               
 file.  If the parties agree on the mediator the judge appoints this           
 choice.  If the parties don't agree there is a process already                
 incorporated in the court rules for the judge to select three                 
 names.  The parties each get an opportunity to challenge and from             
 this list the judge selects the mediator.                                     
                                                                               
 MR. LOGAN stated that the plaintiff and defendant meet with the               
 mediator in formal conference.  Before they meet, the parties can             
 provide the mediator with a brief of not more than five pages                 
 explaining the situation as they see it.  The mediator can meet               
 individually with each party after an initial meeting with everyone           
 present.  The meetings are private, the discussions are                       
 confidential and the mediator cannot be called upon in court to               
 discuss what happened during these meetings.  After these meetings,           
 the information is reviewed and each party's position is assessed.            
 If someone wants out and they don't believe they can get what they            
 want from this process the mediation is terminated.  If the parties           
 do want to continue they do so with help from the mediator and when           
 or if they reach settlement, the plaintiff files for a motion for             
 dismissal.  The defendant writes the check and that's the end of              
 it.                                                                           
                                                                               
 Number 2165                                                                   
                                                                               
 MR. LOGAN noted a letter of support from the Alaska Design                    
 Professionals in the packet and this 5,000 member organization,               
 through their Legislative Action Committee, have asked for this               
 legislation.  He added that after a review of the files related to            
 this legislation, before HB 414 was proposed last session (a bill             
 that addressed this issue), he found a letter from a constituent on           
 December 10, 1994 asking for some type of a pre-trial process to              
 avoid these types of cases.  He gave an historical overview of this           
 legislation's progress and all the work that has gone into this               
 effort.                                                                       
                                                                               
 Number 2330                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE HUDSON referred to the Rules of Court and asked if             
 these were the original province of the legislature or the courts.            
                                                                               
 MR. LOGAN stated that he had no idea.                                         
                                                                               
 Number 2355                                                                   
                                                                               
 DOUG WOOLIVER, Administrative Attorney, Alaska Court System, came             
 forward to provide information on HB 10.  He stated that the court            
 has the primary responsibility for writing court rules, but under             
 the Alaska constitution the legislature can amend these rules by a            
 two-thirds majority vote out of both houses.  The court originally            
 writes them, the legislature can amend them.                                  
                                                                               
 CHAIRMAN ROKEBERG asked what would happen to the rest of a piece of           
 legislation with an incorporated court rule if a two-thirds vote              
 was not obtained.                                                             
                                                                               
 MR. WOOLIVER responded that the rest of the bill would stay as is,            
 just like an effective date.  This happened with tort reform last             
 year.  All the court rules didn't pass so they all got dropped and            
 the rest of the bill stood.                                                   
                                                                               
 Number 2411                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE RYAN noted that Alaska has an excellent set of                 
 statutes related to arbitration and asked if anyone had considered            
 putting this as a first step, arbitration as the second and finally           
 a courtroom hearing for the third option to help relieve the court            
 load.                                                                         
                                                                               
 MR. LOGAN responded that this was considered.  The agreement that             
 the trial attorneys and the design professionals came to was that             
 they wanted something to bind the parties to mediation.  Under                
 Court Rule 100 as it is now, there is an option for mediation, but            
 both sides wanted a motivator to compel people to go through this             
 process.  This is why they seek these changes.                                
                                                                               
 MR. LOGAN added that this process began with a Certificate of Merit           
 which means a tribunal of an attorney, an engineer and some other             
 public member would review these cases as they came in to determine           
 the merits of each.  This original option didn't get the support              
 they needed.  This present legislation did.                                   
                                                                               
 TAPE 97-20, SIDE B                                                            
 Number 005                                                                    
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE HUDSON asked what the response has been from the               
 trial bar.                                                                    
                                                                               
 Number 020                                                                    
                                                                               
 MR. LOGAN stated that he did not know why they weren't present at             
 this meeting.  No written testimony has been received.  They did              
 testify in the past.  A Mr. Russ Winter testified throughout the              
 process last year.  On April 17, of last year, in the House                   
 Judiciary Committee hearing he said, "This may be one of the first            
 instances when the trial lawyers and possible defendants have                 
 reached agreement on change in the court system which is actually             
 quite a nice thing to be able to say."  Mr. Winter did make some              
 points he was still concerned about, one of which was why the scope           
 of the bill was limited only to design professionals.  Mr. Logan              
 noted the simple reason for this was that no one has asked to be              
 included in this during the entire time they've been working on               
 this piece of legislation.                                                    
                                                                               
 Number 079                                                                    
                                                                               
 MR. WOOLIVER noted that the only thing the court asks is that the             
 effective date be dropped, in large part, because this legislation            
 does include court rule changes.  Even if this legislation makes it           
 through both the House and Senate, it might not be transmitted to             
 the governor or signed immediately.  Last year there were several             
 bills signed at the end of June with a July 1 effective date, this            
 makes it extremely difficult to get all the court rules written in            
 a timely manner.  They also ask that it become effective 90 days              
 after the governor's signature.                                               
                                                                               
 Number 120                                                                    
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE HUDSON made a motion to amend HB 10 by technically             
 removing the section 4, line 18, page 2, the effective date by                
 deleting this entire section.  Hearing no objection it was so                 
 moved.  Amendment number one was conceptually adopted.                        
                                                                               
 Number 142                                                                    
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE RYAN moved and asked unanimous consent to move HB 10           
 out of committee with individual recommendations and accompanying             
 fiscal note as amended.  Hearing no objection CSHB 10(L&C) was                
 moved out of the House Labor and Commerce Committee.                          
                                                                               
 ADJOURNMENT                                                                   
                                                                               
 Number 153                                                                    
                                                                               
 CHAIRMAN ROKEBERG adjourned the House Labor and Commerce Committee            
 at 4:15 p.m.                                                                  
                                                                               

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